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Episode discussion - Thursday 13th August 2015
Topic Started: 13 Aug 2015, 16:03 (7,982 Views)
The Local Butcher
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So Liam wants a 100k? Now that's more like it. Do I buy that Liam would sell out his family? Not exactly but seeing Ian blackmailed never stops being satisfying and it's great to see that David and Janine have rubbed off on Liam. I think we can safely guess what Liam's departure will be now. Ian will give in to Liam's blackmail but there will be a price to pay. He can either take the money or take Cindy. He takes the money.
Warning: Posts made by The Local Butcher may contain sarcasm, frustrated expressions of fatigue in the face of Eastenders' neverending insanity, desperate and ill-conceived attempts to be funny, controversial opinions and nuts. Not necessarily in that order.
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Christina
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Dark Ronnie's back....I'd be scared Dean...very scared she will have your boys toys as earrings before the years out. She's not all talk our Ronnie...ask Carl White! Oh yeah You can't Ronnie killed him! Point made!
Nice little scene in The Albert with Ronnie and Sharon, oh and Charlie's reappeared...I was convinced Ronnie was going to smother him with her pillow at one point. Yes Ronnie is interfering in Roxy's love life yet again but this time she has reason too. Her sister is sleeping with a rapist!
Who told James Forde he could act?It's actually painful watching him. Thank god he's leaving! Loved Ian's line about Ricky though.
Jane is having a breakdown. It's taken her long enough!
Good episode.
Edited by Christina, 13 Aug 2015, 20:47.
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Holly
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Christina
13 Aug 2015, 20:45
Dark Ronnie's back....I'd be scared Dean...very scared she will have your boys toys as earrings before the years out. She's not all talk our Ronnie...ask Carl White! Oh yeah You can't Ronnie killed him! Point made!
Nice little scene in The Albert with Ronnie and Sharon, oh and Charlie's reappeared...I was convinced Ronnie was going to smother him with her pillow at one point. Yes Ronnie is interfering in Roxy's love life yet again but this time she has reason too. Her sister is sleeping with a rapist!
Who told James Forde he could act?It's actually painful watching him. Thank god he's leaving! Loved Ian's line about Ricky though.
Jane is having a breakdown. It's taken her long enough!
Good episode.
My feelings summed up perfectly
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Christina
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Aww thanks Holly!
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NevermindMe
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Ergh, hating Ronnie and Dean can result in minimal investment during scenes producers desperately want us to find exciting.

Fail.
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Mrs Peel
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This has been a good week, and this was a better than average episode. However, it went a long way in showing how sometimes, however hard it is, the plug has to be pulled on some characters. Ronnie Mitchell and the Cokers, I'm looking at you.

Pantomime Time. The only thing good about the continuing borefest of Cokerdom is that Paul got the line of the night.

Dead people are backing up.

That one line alone encapsulated the bizarro world that made up this entire episode. I kept expecting to hear Rod Serling's voice and the unmistakable creepy-crawly doo-dee-doo-doo-doo-dee-doo-doo electronic theme from The Twilight Zone ...



Everything Les does is in exaggeration. I keep telling myself it's because Roger Sloman is a theatrical actor as opposed to someone more at home in the realm of film and television. Tonight, it was intimated that he has a drink problem, which resurfaces every time "Birdie" flies the coup. But his walk is exaggerated, his distaste at Paul's poor attempt to make coffee - who makes someone breakfast and then eats it, themselves? - was a grossly exaggerated face-pull, his stalking from the room to his bedroom announcing that he needed a good cup of coffee, was an exit, stage left moment. Even the opening scene of him staring despondently out the window, whilst nursing a whiskey was an exaggeration.

In fact, even when he wasn't there, his exaggerated presence pervaded the flat - the bed was a tousled exaggeration.

Les can't call Pam. She won't pick up the phone, and she won't call him. What I can't understand is this: Both Les and Paul know she is at "Mim's", whoever the hell Mim is, why can't one of them just go around to Mim's and see her?

Simples.

No, instead, we are subjected to a different version of the same scene which is interminably boring. Les pines for Pam, overreacts, Paul tries to help him, Les overreacts, Paul takes time off work, Les disappears.

I get it. This was the Cokers' chance to have a main storyline and be centre stage for awhile during the summer months. It bombed. I could care less about Les, to use a bad pun. He works well enough as a recurring character or even a background character, but neither he nor his wife interest me in the least, and I'm only interested in Paul to the extent that I want to see what happens when his relationship with Ben is out in the open, not when he's scowling and running after his nan and grandad and worrying about his grandad humping some rank old skank.

This storyline is stinking more than the dead people backing up in Les's embalming room.

The Ronnie Horror Picture Show.



I have to say it.

Ronnie's face. This is the walking advertisment for why too much botox isn't good for you. Add collagen-enhanced lips for the final effect. Who wears make-up in bed? I couldn't take my eyes off her weirdly made-up face in the early morning scene when she and Roxy were going at it hammer and tongs in the Blisters' living room.

Widdle Wonnie's bored because no one will play with her. I wonder if Jack snored? I doubt it, because in PsychoRonnie world, Jack's shit probably didn't smell. So now she's got a man who fathered a baby she seems to be lumbered with, who looks like he needs a bath, who snores and who's actually serious, when he's not meant to be playing nanny, about earning a crust at the job he pretends to do.

I want to know this ... whatever happened to that wonderful Boxing Club she ripped money off Phil to buy? It must be a nice little earner to run itself, as she never seems to go around there. I seem to remember her vaguely mentioning selling the thing, but that was only when she was contemplating leaving Wallford - you know, one of the many times she threatened to do so and never did. A small amount of money goes a long way in Walford, doesn't it?

One of the best scenes of this episode took place when Roxy confronted Ronnie. Roxy's got a job now - not much, you understand, but it gives her a feeling of worth, a little responsibility and she likes it. And when Ronnie confronts her about her continued romantic association with Dean, Roxy more than just holds her own. I was punching the air tonight when Roxy let rip with a litany of shit Ronnie's done, starting with kidnapping a baby. Roxy actually levelled that at the po-faced bitch. But then, she mentioned something else ...

And what about Carl White? Let's talk about Carl White, shall we? Because, funny enough, I quite liked him, and thanks to you, he ends up dead.

What a significant sentence! Not only does Roxy still remember that Ronnie's a murderer, she also is brave enough to admit, even after Ronnie's accused her of being attracted to dipshit men, to having liked Carl a lot; secondly, Carl White's been getting more than his share of mentions recently - especially from Vincent and now from Roxy. All these murders being covered up in Walford. Were justice eventually done, you'd rid the show of half the cast - Ronnie, Phil, Roxy, Sharon, Shirley, Charlie, Ian, Jane, Cindy, Bobby, Liam ... Did I miss anyone?

More than that, Roxy brings up the subject she perennially introduces every time she falls out with Ronnie over whatever man Roxy happens to be seeing - how Ronnie's a control freak, especially where Roxy's life is concerned. Just like Abi, Roxy asserts tonight that she is an adult - the only difference between her and Abi is that Roxy, at thirty-seven, actually is more than an adult.

In fact, both the Blisters are rapidly-ageing dollybirds. One is a psychopath with repressed sapphic leanings towards her sister. This is a weird relationship, and creepy as hell. You get the feeling that if Ronnie could have her way, Roxy would be in her bed - a thought that would thoroughly horrify Roxy - but since she won't go that far, she's willing to let Roxy have the occasional boyfriend, whom she'll vet, as long as it's not permanent. She was, eventually, quite willing to accept Aleks, who defied her, as long as he towed the line; but then again, during this relationship, Ronnie became pregnant and was gone a good deal of the time.

Roxy, however, either likes edgy men or she invariably ends up sleeping with whoever is committed to her psycho sister. And Ronnie cannot stand the idea of Roxy having any sort of normal relationship.

Then there's the relationship between Roxy and Dean.

Look, we all know what Dean is, even though Roxy is taking the technical aspect of the fact that nothing was ever proven about what Dean did, even though the viewer, and many residents in Walford believe and know him capable of the rape he committed. Dean knows what he did, as much as creepy Bobby Beale knows what he did, except Dean's adult modus operandi is to keep denying the truth until he finds someone other than his mother to believe him.

He's found Roxy.

The other interesting, albeit brief, scene, occurred between Ronnie and Sharon. Ronnie seeking advice from Sharon? Well, no, she's only trying to ply information from Sharon about what Linda told her about Dean, but Sharon is decent enough to respect Linda's confidence, even though she, herself, believes that Dean is a rapist. So much for Roswell's remark about Sharon being almost a Mitchell - she's more a Mitchell than Ronnie knows, based on the advice she gave her - keep your friends close and your enemies closer. Make friends with the enemy.

And so we have Roxy caught between the rock that's a psychopathic murderer, and the hard place that's a rapist. What a choice she'll have!

Ronnie's a big tough bitch to threaten Dean with skinning him alive, which she'd probably do, but sooner or later - and her time for karma is rapidly running out - she'll get caught. The fact that Carl White is getting so many mentions now means something is rising on the horizon. She can smirk all she wants about spooking Dean, but Dean has something over on her as well, which he revealed in yet another confrontational scene with Roxy, when he was trying to convince her to move out of Ronnie's house, and Roxy was playing the old "she's-mah-sisTAH" card.

Once again, I punched the air when Dean actually told Roxy that pretty soon she'd be in her fifties, still living with Ronnie and Ronnie calling the shots on everything she did. I have often said that Ronnie and Roxy would morph into the Mitchells' version of Babe and Sylvie in thirty years' time - less than that, as Ronnie, herself is less than a decade off the big 5-0.

On the one hand, the 37 year-old childwoman is whining about her sis-TAH watching over her, when Dean finally decides to reveal to Roxy that Ronnie isn't watching over her ... she's watching her. Cue the hidden webcam.

It's been heavily foreshadowed that Dean will cop it. Most likely Ronnie will kill him, but I hope that either she's caught - and Shirley would never let go of that - or she's killed, herself; because this lazy actress and her character are well-past the sell-by date for this programme. She's a killer who's shown no remorse, and he's a rapist trying to convince himself and others that he didn't commit his crime. Both are control freaks and both are as bad as one another.

They both need slapping down. Fatally.

The Road to Hell. With all the emphasis on Max being Liam's uncle tonight, I wanted to scream at the television that Ian's his uncle also, and I expected Ian to retort just that when Liam pointed out that Max was his uncle. In the end, he didn't have to do that at all, because Liam proved himself to be strongly endowed with the Beale gene when he named his price for his silence and his terms for departure.

I knew he wouldn't go to Devon, and I knew there was a reason for mentioning Ricky being in Dusseldorf those months back -and apparently thriving. This offers Liam a place to go, and he's put a price to Uncle Ian for his silence.

It does bother me how Liam apparently doesn't realise that his Grandad David and Ian Beale are brothers. Bianca more than knew, and mention of her being Ian's niece was mentioned several times, but her children never seemed to be aware of this, and Bianca, herself, often referred to Ian as "Ian Beale."

There is now no turning back for Ian, and this uncomfortable storyline is painful to watch, but it's interesting, like a trainwreck, to see how the worm has turned in the Beale household. Jane, who coerced and emotionally blackmailed that entire family unit into covering for the murderer of Ian's daughter, the motivating force about the family keeping a normal appearance, is now crushing herself under the weight of guilt at seeing someone innocent be accused, charged and perhaps imprisoned for a crime he didn't commit.

On that night back in February, where the shit hit the fan, Ian presumed that, after awhile, the police would just close the case on Lucy, and as long as there were no new developments and it appeared that they were closing the case, the Beales were able to function normally. Once, however, a new witness had been found, the deluge of amoral diarrhea flooded the place, and the stench of guilt was too much to bear for Jane.

Now, it's Ian calling the shots - but whereas Jane's prime motivation in all of this was, genuinely, to protect Bobby, Ian's motivation is to protect his big-bellied fat arse. Bobby figures into the equation in only that he's Ian's last child to remain with him, and he'd rather have an unwanted child who murdered his favourite child, than to have no child at all. Also, the Beales are morbidly tied together in this secret, and it means that Jane can never ever leave Ian, so he'll never be alone.

The thought of that house of horrors rotting in the stink of their wrong-doing makes an ageing Ronnie and Roxy look almost appealing.

Liam has a moral compass. However weak in other aspects Ricky and Bianca may have been, they did raise their children to tell the truth. That was Lou Beale's legacy in Bianca's DNA, and that's been passed onto Liam. He's right to refuse to go to Devon, and he's right to want to tell Carol the truth about who killed Lucy. If (when) it's discovered that the blood traces in the car lot were Lucy's, then Max is in deep shit, and Carol needs to know that he's innocent and why.

It was sickening too how callous Ian has become when he clutched at the straw of the blood results as a means of getting themselves in the clear. Jane, however, has suddenly found her conscience. She knows Max, and however much Ian tries to fanagle her into believing that Max was bad, she knows better.

Max Branning may have been bad and he may have been up to all sorts with women, Ian, but you know yourself that he's no murderer.

That's Jane's euphemistic way of saying that Max isn't the murderer because they know who did kill Lucy.It was chilling the pleasure Ian took in telling Carol about Lucy's blood being found in the car lot.

Max being beaten up and Carol accusing him on the basis of that blood sample shows the irony of Max telling the truth for once in his life. And did I hear correctly, that Tanya, the attempted murderer, the self-righteous slut who was a marriage-wrecker before she was twenty, is now now even taking his calls? I never thoughr I'd live to see the day I'd be calling for Lauren to return. Lauren, by now, knows who killed Lucy, and all it takes is her finding out this new development for her to return to tell the truth.

Ian won't be able to stop her.

Just when you think Ian couldn't get more morally reprehensible, we have that hurtful, hateful scene where he bullied and berated and frightened the hell out of two kids into staying onside. Ian couldn't have done that to two adults - to a Mick and Linda Carter, for example. He'd be told where to shove it. Liam was rightly. I was amazed at Liam's strength of will, standing up to Ian and reminding him of what's wrong and what's right.

Cindy knows exactly what Bobby is and what he's capable of, and she was right, in her own way, when she referred to him as a freak. He pushed her, hard, and as Liam reiterated, he killed Lucy. Ian is prepared to go with the lie of Max having hit Lucy (when she fell and hit her head), reckoning that a jewelry box wouldn't have been weapon enough to have killed Lucy. Well, if the person wielding it as a weapon stoved it into her head hard enough, it would; and we saw how hard and how ferociously Bobby pushed Cindy.

Whereas Jane can still summon enough strength to argue about Bobby's character - her weak pushback at Cindy's remark about Bobby being a freak - Ian is fighting only for Ian. Using Bobby is an advantage to his case. Even Jane can't stand the pot-bellied monster holding court and bullying freely in the Beales' front room, with Cindy and Liam ironically occupying the couch on which Lucy died.

Ian resorts to emotional blackmail with Cindy, using Jane, who's retreated, weeping to the kitchen, accusing Cindy of putting Jane through this turmoil, when Jane, herself, has been responsible for this situation. When Cindy won't buy that and when Liam insists that sacrificing Max is wrong, when he did nothing, when they both refuse to go, Ian then resorts to scare tactics, part of which is a blatant lie. If they won't go, then they'll have to stay on the Square and keep their mouths shut, and if they won't do that, they'll have to call the police. He dares Cindy to do so, but Liam's up to it. And that's when Ian drops the clanger.

If Liam tells the police, he'll go to prison too. Oh, yes, Jane and Ian would go, and he doesn't know how long they'd get, but Liam and Cindy would go too, as having perverted the course of justice, hidden evidence etc.

Wrong! And just wrong enough to take advantage of these kids; youth. For a start, Liam wouldn't go to prison at all. He's only just been told, and he attempted on several occasions to tell the truth, but was stopped by Ian. He was even bribed by Ian with a one-way ticket to Devon - something Carol picked up on when she confronted Ian about it. The fact that Ian bribed Liam would go very badly against Ian, and the one-way ticket would be proof of that. There is no way Liam - before he had the mockers put on him by Ian tonight and turned the screws by bribing Ian for his silence, would have gone to prison.

It's even debatable if Cindy would have. She's been the most willing to speak out about what happened, and if she had a good enough brief to do a deal for Cindy to give Crown evidence in exchange for all charges (of perverting the course of justice) to be dropped, she'd be off safe. As long as Peter is out of the country, if his name is brought up, he's safe enough; but Cindy could be his key because she knew how reluctant he was to follow suit with the plan.

We're looking at a secure institution for Bobby, or at the very least, Young Offenders, if he can benefit from that; for Ian and Jane, Jane especially, and now Ian, we are looking at serious time.

Jane, I think, is morally responsibile enough now to realise that and even to accept her fate. She'd even confess to the crime, herself, to protect that little scrote; but Ian is looking out for two things in particular - his own fat arse, and his empire.

He has passed the point of no return now. How they can attempt to salvage his character is beyond me. When the truth does come to light, I hope he's shunned by everyone. However his mother will probably blame herself for this.

Ian is Kathy's Nick.
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Mrs Peel
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Cam
13 Aug 2015, 19:36
Sam Womack's shouting voice is the most irritating thing in soap (bar Sonia in general).
It's not just her voice. It's time to think about reining in the botox and the collagen. #seriouslyscary
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Blades' receptionist
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Liam had some great lines tonight. Nice to hear a Ricky mention too. I thought Jake was brilliant in that episode - poor Max!
"They don't know that we know that they know"
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Mrs Peel
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RadioIan
13 Aug 2015, 19:52
Ian is beyond contempt. That was despicable. I find it hard to believe Liam, at least, would face any prosecution whatsoever - he's barely known for five minutes...
Liam wouldn't face any prosecution. He tried on several occasions to tell the truth and was impeded by Ian. Ian even attempted to bribe him by sending him away from Walford. That, alone, would land Ian in deep doo-doo.

It's even debatable that Cindy would face incarceration. If she had a good enough brief and was willing to turn Crown evidence against the Beales in exchange for all charges being dropped, she'd be off scot-free too.

Ian and Jane are looking at serious time, however, and I actually hope they get it.
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Mrs Peel
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NevermindMe
13 Aug 2015, 19:55
Fuck off Ronnie.
Fuck off Dean.
Fuck off Sonia.
Fuck off Vincent.

That is all.
You forgot Tina and Les.
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Mrs Peel
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WalfordCommon
13 Aug 2015, 20:15
Liam ridiculously out of character. Makes me think they'll bring him back played by a new actor and completely remould him as something completely different more in line with his Grandad David perhaps.
He needs to remember that Grandad David and Ian are brothers, and Ian bears the same relationship to him as Max does. Ian and Max are both his great-uncles.

Liam should return, in about 7 years' time, played by a competent actor and intent on making Ian Beale realise his relationship to Liam and how badly Ian's treated his extended family. Ian was quick to corner Bianca after she was part and parcel in destroying his restaurant, and it was Denise who talked him out of calling the police.

Ian really needs to suffer socially when this is resolved.
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TellyAddict
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Wondering if that chart in Ronnie and Roxy's house is a height chart or Veronica's body count.
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Mrs Peel
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Christina
13 Aug 2015, 20:45
Dark Ronnie's back....I'd be scared Dean...very scared she will have your boys toys as earrings before the years out. She's not all talk our Ronnie...ask Carl White! Oh yeah You can't Ronnie killed him! Point made!
Nice little scene in The Albert with Ronnie and Sharon, oh and Charlie's reappeared...I was convinced Ronnie was going to smother him with her pillow at one point. Yes Ronnie is interfering in Roxy's love life yet again but this time she has reason too. Her sister is sleeping with a rapist!
A murderer presumes to judge a rapist? Ronnie is no better than Dean. She is in no position to sit in judgement on him. Both characters need serious karma. I hope they kill each other.
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Christina
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That would be a good way of getting rid of both of them at once
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Holly
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Mrs Peel, I'm just curious, if you could choose only one of Ronnie or Dean to leave, who would it be? No killing each other or one getting arrested for the murder of another, just one to leave and one to stay, who would it be?
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Sey
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I have never made any secret of the fact I enjoy Dean and his characterisation, for better or worse. However that scene in the Albert was a bit weird, Sharon and Ronnie cackling about Dean like he was just a horny loser rather than an actual rapist who destroyed Linda's life. Odd.
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The Local Butcher
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Mrs Peel
13 Aug 2015, 22:09
Liam should return, in about 7 years' time, played by a competent actor and intent on making Ian Beale realise his relationship to Liam and how badly Ian's treated his extended family.
Well I like to imagine that Liam asking for the 100k is his way of saying "So you think I'm worthless do you? So tell me Ian exactly how much am I worth to you now?".
Warning: Posts made by The Local Butcher may contain sarcasm, frustrated expressions of fatigue in the face of Eastenders' neverending insanity, desperate and ill-conceived attempts to be funny, controversial opinions and nuts. Not necessarily in that order.
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Mrs Peel
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I couldn't make a choice, because both are equally as morally reprehensible as the other. Both are control freaks, although Ronnie is totally a psychopath, and Dean is, at least, able to empathise with situations. Dean's problems come from his rejection issues and also his issues with women, and those problems can be traced back to his mother. Ronnie comes from a family, half of whom wallow in generational alcoholism linked to violence, and the other half are generational psychopaths. On the one hand we have Eric begatting Phil, but on the other we have Archie begatting Ronnie, and their problems go back to the biggest psychopath of the family, Grandpa Phil, father of Archie and Eric (and the forgotten Clive).

Ronnie has no remorse for anything she's done, including murder, because she's arrogant enough and entitled enough to think she's above all that. She's obsessed with her sister and controlling her sister's life. Dean is delusional. He knows what he's done and he's hiding behind the fact that the CPS didn't have enough evidence to secure a conviction in his case, which he thinks, presumes his innocence. It doesn't.

Making a choice between one of the other if like choosing death by firing squad or by electrocution - one is as bad as the other. There was once a time on the show where people who committed a serious crime were suitably punished or paid for the crime with their lives. Now we have such serious moral torpor, it's mind-boggling.

Sharon's covered up two murders, and is about to cover three. Phil, Shirley, Roxy, Charlie Dean and now Ian and Jane have been drawn into very serious situations which more than question their inherent decency.

You have to wonder where all this will end.

Both Ronnie and Dean should go.
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Christina
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I have nothing add. Mrs Peel just said it all perfectly. Thanks!
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Christina
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I love how detailed your reviews are Mrs Peel.
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